Jonah Hill opens up about anxieties and triumphs in making ‘Mid90s’

Jonah
Hill.
Dimitrios Kambouris/Getty;
Shayanne Gal/Business Insider

• “Mid90s” is Jonah Hill’s directorial debut, and he talked to
  Business Insider about why skateboarding was something that was
  always going to be in the movie.
• He said that a reason he’s taken so long to go forward with
  directing is he knew he had to first become mature enough to be a
  leader on set.
• Hill also explained how he used his own acting talents to get
  performances out of his cast of mostly kid actors and non-actors.

The culture surrounding skateboarding has often been negatively
depicted in films, and perhaps the movie that exemplifies that
best in the last few decades is Larry Clark’s 1995 gritty X-rated
indie “Kids.”

It’s the quintessential “don’t give an F” Gen Xer coming-of-age
movie, complete with someone getting bashed in the head with a
skateboard. And for a generation since, the depiction of
skateboarders in films hasn’t really changed. They are usually a
group of people bent on creating as much chaos as possible, and
are often a nuisance to everyone in the story.

But Jonah Hill wants to change that.

For Hill, skate culture is a nurturing one in which people look
out for one another and aren’t out to cause trouble. He wanted to
show that. Though he loves “Kids,” Hill wanted to make the
anti-“Kids” movie: Something seeped in the 1990s (Hill would have
been just around the same age as the characters depicted in
“Kids” in 1995), but looking at skateboarders in a very different
way. And with that, he was ready to make his directorial debut.

“Mid90s” (opening in theaters on Friday) marks the latest chapter
in the evolution of Hill. He’s gone from one of Judd Apatow’s
funny discoveries, to a serious actor who has earned Oscar
nominations working opposite Brad Pitt (“Moneyball”) and Leonardo
DiCaprio (“The Wolf of Wall Street”), to an unlikely spirit guide
for millennials who study everything he posts on his Instagram
account. But through all of that, he says being a filmmaker has
been his main goal, and after four years of crafting “Mid90s” —
which included him toiling over 20 drafts of the script — it has
finally come true.

“Mid90s.”
Tobin
Yelland/A24

In the film, Stevie (Sunny Suljic) is a 13-year-old living in Los
Angeles who has no friends and gets bullied all the time by his
older brother, Ian (Lucas Hedges), while their mother (Katherine
Waterston) works constantly to make ends meet. With a lot of free
time, Stevie roams around his neighborhood looking for anything
to do, or more importantly, anyone to do things with. That’s when
he comes across a group of teens at a skate shop. Seeing the fun
group dynamic, the cool skate moves, and joy on all their faces,
Stevie is instantly hooked. He decides to walk into the shop. And
that’s when his life changes.

From the movie’s narrow 4:3 format that makes you feel like you
have been sucked into a skate video, to its comedy, authentic
performances by its untrained actors, and incredible soundtrack
(that includes memorable needle drops from Morrissey, Wu-Tang
Clan, Nirvana, A Tribe Called Quest, and even Herbie Hancock),
Hill has not just succeeded on his mission to make the
anti-“Kids,” but has once more shown that his talents go far
beyond the public’s perception of him.

Business Insider sat down with Hill on a quiet Sunday at the New
York City offices of the film’s distributor, A24, to talk about
the maturity he admits he had to gain to finally go forward with
directing, the reason he didn’t cast himself in the movie, the
impassioned letters he wrote to legendary artists to get their
songs in the movie, and the emotional moment he had with his cast
the first night the movie was shown to the public.

Jason Guerrasio: Do you remember the moment in
your acting career when you were on set and began to really focus
on what a director does?

Jonah Hill: From the beginning. 

Guerrasio: So “I Heart Huckabees”?

Hill: Yeah. David O. Russell was the first
filmmaker I worked for. I was 18 and it’s really funny because he
has since, definitely, done a lot of work on himself and
apologized to a lot of people. But it was pretty publicly known
that was an interesting set. And I was like, “This is what
directing is like?” [laughs] “Holy s–t!” You’re 18
years old and you think that’s what the world is like. But I
still learned quite a bit from how brilliant David is. To me, it
was all film school. And I love acting. But to me, my goal was
always to be a filmmaker. And being a cinephile and studying all
my favorite filmmakers, like Mike Nichols and Barry Levinson, is
that when they made their first films they had these accomplished
careers already. So when they made that first one it really had
to mean something. They had done all this incredible work that
wasn’t personal beforehand, and to me, that was my example. Don’t
do it until you have something to say.

Guerrasio: Though you have been on set since you
were 18, did you still feel like you needed some practice as a
director? You did two music videos before “Mid90s,” but would you
even make short films, just to do the filmmaking motions before a
feature?

Hill: No, because I have been in 10,000 scenes.
Blocking and acting wasn’t even going to be the issue of
directing, for me. Getting all your crew and your actors to share
your vision — leadership was more the thing I had to mature into
than skill. I was always the young person on set and now it’s
time to be the adult, so it was more, am I mature enough to lead
a group of people? If I’m asking them to believe in me, do I know
I’m going to come through for them?

Jonah Hill said what’s
held him back from directing is that he knew he had to mature
into being someone who could lead on set.
Tobin Yelland/A24

Guerrasio: So doing the music videos — “Gonna Get Over You” for Sara Bareilles and
“Ain’t It Funny” for Danny Brown —
did you go into that mindset? Needing to show your leadership
skills?

Hill: Yeah. That was practicing with my crew.
The Danny Brown video we shot before the movie. And Gus [Van
Sant’s] movie [“Don’t Worry, He Won’t Get Far on Foot”] was just
before, so randomly a lot of that crew I had already hired for
“Mid90s.” 

Guerrasio: Did that form a shorthand with the
crew going into “Mid90s”?

Hill: The machine was already pretty oiled up,
so it really helped us. But at the same time, I hand picked this
crew. They had some connection to this culture and they were also
the artists that I admired over my 15-year career and have a deep
respect for. 

Guerrasio: Why skateboarding? What did you feel
you could do cinematically with that?

Hill: Skateboarding had always been butchered in
films. It’s always done disrespectfully. So I took on a pretty
major task, which I knew would be ready to be pounced on by
skateboarders, but I knew I could show it respectfully and not
from a place of authority but from a place of love and respect.
Something that came into my life and gave me a lot when I needed
it. Skateboarding is such a specific thing. The punk, anti-ethic.
What draws in people who want to fall over and over again? It’s a
community of individuals that find each other. I knew in some
form skateboarding would be a part of my first film because it
gave me a whole outlook on things.

Guerrasio: That’s what’s fascinating, in the
buildup to seeing this movie, like the first teaser, you get the
vibe of it being another “Kids.” That Larry Clark/Harmony Korine
darker side of the culture. But when you see the movie it’s clear
you went a completely different path. You show the positivity of
what the culture can bring to an outsider.

Hill: The movie was made with such consideration
of “Kids.” I love “Kids.” [“Kids” screenwriter] Harmony [Korine] is one of my close friends and he read the script and gave notes
and he loves the film. He wants to play both on a double bill. To
me, I knew people were going to think it’s just a rip off of
“Kids,” but I didn’t care because I had this story to tell in
this time period. And I knew if I did it right then it won’t
matter once it comes out. But it’s the anti-”Kids.” “Kids” is so
beautiful in its nihilism. That’s the point of “Kids” — the world
ends tomorrow, f–k it, blow up everything. And I wasn’t like
that. I was searching for meaning and connection and a reason to
build a life and friendships. This is not a biopic in any way,
these are characters I made up, but I wanted to show how hard it
is to find a connection. I think my voice as a filmmaker is going
to be about the beauty of connection and the difficulty of
getting there. Even a little bit gives you the fuel to keep going
in a world that’s not always so fun. 

“Kids.”
Shining Excalibur Films

Guerrasio: And you’ve also given props to
“This Is England,” which I feel is such an
underappreciated coming-of-age movie. 

Hill: “This Is England” and “Fish Tank” are bigger influences than
“Kids” was, for me. “This Is England” was the only film I showed
the kids in the movie before we started shooting. [“This Is
England” director] Shane Meadows made such a beautiful film and
also showing how young kids can give such raw performances. I
wanted the kids to see that acting can be like this. That’s the
acting I like. That’s the naturalism that I like. So I didn’t
show them a lot of films. The whole thing was to make a reverse
skate video. In skate videos growing up it would be all
skateboarding and three seconds of these kids causing chaos and
really connecting and just hanging out. When I was a kid that’s
what I wanted. So this is the reverse. Kids connecting and three
seconds of skateboarding. To invert that was really my
goal. 

Guerrasio: Was the plan always to cast
non-actors?

Hill: Yes. To me I knew I was going to turn
skateboarders into actors because you can’t fake that and I
wanted these kids to feel on screen like they weren’t actors. But
then they became actors and that’s the most surprising and moving
part of the process. 

Guerrasio: So that was your master plan going
in?

Hill: Yeah. I always knew I was going to find
kids and turn them into actors. 

Guerrasio: You didn’t worry about finding them?

Hill: Oh, I worried about it. [laughs] I worried about finding the right ones. The most rewarding
experience of my life is watching them care and try. They are not
playing themselves. They are saying lines that they didn’t think
of. They are playing characters that are not them. They could
have just gone through the motions and I could have gotten the
performances out of them that way, but instead they were so
inspired to become actors. Now they are obsessed with film. They
want to act. 

Guerrasio: The movie has such a free-form feel,
but there was a fleshed-out script?

Hill: Oh yeah. Three years and 20 drafts with
[producer] Scott Rudin. Writing is my main thing so that
dialogue, that’s how they spoke back then, it took me three years
to make a script that felt right. My goal to the crew was kill
yourself to make it look like you did nothing. Anything that
looked effortless took the most effort, so that right there is
three years and 20 drafts. [laughs]

Guerrasio: With Scott Rudin looking over your
shoulder.

Hill: No joke. 

Guerrasio: When a famous person makes a movie
often times what happens is they put themselves in it because
that’s the only way they can get the money to make it. You are
not in “Mid90s” but did you ever face that scenario?

Hill: Never. No. I don’t want you to think of
me. The way I see it, the director is the painter and the actors
are really an important color in a painting. So I have been a
“green” my whole life. I can be a pretty good green, but if the
director wants to paint purple over it then that’s up to them. To
me, this is my first painting. This is the first thing that
represents me. I have only been a color in other people’s
paintings. So I don’t want you to think of me. I want you to
watch these kids and watch this film and view this as a film. I
didn’t want anyone to take you out of it. I was even hesitant to
cast Lucas and Katherine because I didn’t want you to think this
is a movie made by someone you’ve seen in films. I want you to
think this is a story I’m watching and these are kids that I’m
watching. 

Guerrasio: So there was never a point where if
you just were in two scenes you could get the money that,
say, got you an extra day of shooting you needed?

Hill: It was off the table. 

(L-R) Lucas Hedges and
Sunny Suljic in “Mid90s.”
Tobin
Yelland/A24

Guerrasio: That’s commendable, because there are
a lot of examples where the person in your situation had no other
choice but be in the movie.

Hill: But this movie falls apart the second you
break the idea of what it is. If you break one rule, you try to
cheat one way, the whole house falls down. I could have made a
lot of other things as my first film, but I was like, I’m doing
this and I am never going to make a false move that breaks the
ethic of this movie. 

Guerrasio: Shooting it in the narrow 4:3 format,
that’s very non-traditional. When did you come up with that and
how hard did you have to fight to keep the movie in that format?

Hill: I had to fight very hard. First, it helps
the feel of it being this lost film from the ’90s. But the main
reason was originally we were planning to intercut the High 8
footage within the film but when you cut from the normal aspect
ration to the High 8 it was really jarring and it took you out of
it. So we knew we were shooting Super 16mm, and when we tested it
in 4:3 and intercut with the High 8, it cut like butter and
didn’t take you out of the movie.

Getting it approved is a whole other story and could be its own
documentary. [laughs] There is only one film that has
made over $100 million that uses it, and doesn’t even use it the
whole time, and that’s “The Grand Budapest Hotel.” So I gave a
whole presentation to A24 with clips from only one movie. I would
talk for a while and then show a clip and it’s from “The Grand
Budapest Hotel.” I didn’t have another film to show them. So I
would be like, “And then I have this other idea,” and it would be
another clip from “The Grand Budapest Hotel.” But we got it done.

Guerrasio: The soundtrack is another aspect of
the movie that sucks you in. Did you personally have to make some
calls and write some letters to artists to get songs you wanted?

Hill: We didn’t have a big music budget. I music
supervised the movie, so every song in the movie, that song was
written in specifically for that scene. And we got every
song. 

Guerrasio: Wow. 

Hill: I wrote Morrissey a letter, I wrote Herbie
Hancock a letter. And I just showed people the film and really
told them emotionally what it means to have that song at that
moment in the movie. Morrissey was the first to say yes, I
figured he would be the hardest, and he was lovely. Once I got
Morrissey and Q-Tip, then I got Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross to
score it, people were aware that it was something of quality
because I was lucky enough to get those cosigns. Then we went
from there. 

Guerrasio: You got Seal’s “Kiss from a Rose” in
the movie, filmmakers have told me in the past that’s a hard one
to get cleared.

Hill: Actually, the hardest, by far, was Herbie
Hancock. He doesn’t license his music for films and I wrote him a
letter about what that meant to me. He was so cool to give us
that. 

Guerrasio: I have to say that I loved you in
“Maniac,” I think it’s the best work you’ve ever done. And

I asked Cary Fukunaga how your process is and he described it
as this: “He’s not necessary Method, but it’s close to it in
really trying to feel what the character is going through.” How
can you relate the talent you have and how you know a performance
should be done to another actor? Let alone, in the instance of
“Mid90s,” kids who aren’t really trained?

Hill: You have to develop a true trust and
connection with kids if you are going to work with them. Because
you’re asking them to be vulnerable and you’re asking them to do
things that people don’t want to do, let alone someone who is
going through an awkward time in their life. So for me, I was
like, “I will not let you down.” I would just have long
conversations with each kid about what’s happening underneath and
what they’re carrying with them no matter what they are saying.
That’s hours and hours and hours of conversations about feelings,
about life experiences, about goals. Just talking about who these
people are eventually absorbs into you. That’s how I act. That is
just hours and hours and hours of thinking and talking. Yes, it’s
not exactly Method, but it’s something close to it. I have to be
feeling those feelings and that’s why acting gets harder and
harder sometimes because if it’s darker it’s not exactly a place
you want to live in for a long period of time. 

Guerrasio: How has directing changed you as an
actor?

Hill: I don’t think it has. I just think they
are so different. But hopefully they can blend in where all I
want to do are things that mean something to me. “Mid90s” means
something to me, it matters to me, and I hope I just keep doing
things that matter to me and that I care about. 

Guerrasio: Have you even thought about what you
want to direct next? Perhaps something with a higher budget?

Hill: I would never think that way. I would
never think, “I want to do this kind of film.” You have to fall
in love again. So when I fall in love again I’ll do what’s right
for that film. If it’s a $1 million movie or whatever. 

Jonah Hill getting emotional during the standing
ovation following the world premiere screening of “Mid90s” at the
Toronto International Film Festival.
Jason Guerrasio

Guerrasio: I was at the world premiere of
“Mid90s” at the Toronto International Film Festival. There was a
standing ovation for you when you came out on stage after it
played. You got choked up standing there, what did that moment
mean to you?

Hill: When I saw “Moneyball” for the first time
it was at the TIFF world premiere, and I got really emotional
after because I had never seen my hard work pay off in that way.
So I gave the kids that kind of experience and I didn’t show them
the movie. That was the first time all the kids saw the film. So
what you guys didn’t see was backstage the kids were all
hysterical crying. Once I saw them backstage I was a mess, so I
was trying to hold it together to go out on stage. I realized
what they saw, as young people, is if you work hard here’s what
you can accomplish. It tore me up. So I walked out there, and of
course getting a standing ovation as a filmmaker is pretty much
the biggest dream I could ever have. I’ve wanted to be a
filmmaker my whole life. But why I got choked up was I was
carrying the emotion of those kids. It was the most surreal
emotional feeling of my life.